Thursday, November 12, 2009

Five years in prison for not buying government approved insurance

Forget tea parties, I want a pitchfork party. THIS is what I hate about big government most of all. It always comes with a gun pointed at you, handcuffs, and prisons. We put too many people in jail to begin with in this country, and this will only add more.

From Ed Morrisey - There's a youtube clip too.

It’s very fair to send people who disregard the federal mandate to buy health insurance to prison, Nancy Pelosi says, because otherwise they’ll assault citizens … with a bill for medical services … or something.

Stone: Do you think it’s fair to send people to jail who don’t buy health insurance?

Pelosi: … The legislation is very fair in this respect.

Morrisey comments

Of course, the other option is to make people responsible for paying their own bills. Nothing requires us to pick up the tab for people in clinics or emergency rooms, especially those who can afford to pay their way. This is the point that Pelosi and her statist colleagues seem to forget

This most of all is why I oppose the so called reform. This is why I oppose insurance requirements by law of any sort whatsoever, including auto insurance. At least no auto insurance is only a ticket if you drive. If you don't do things the government way here, you get a gun pointed at your head, handcuffed, and sent to club fed.

If you don't like Morrisey's source, The Hill reports the same thing.

he nonpartisan Joint Committee on Taxation reported that the House version of the healthcare bill specifies that those who don’t buy health insurance and do not pay the fine of about 2.5 percent of their income for failing to do so can face a penalty of up to five years in prison!

The bill describes the penalties as follows:

• Section 7203 — misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.

• Section 7201 — felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3]

That anyone should face prison for not buying health insurance is simply incredible.

And how much will the stay-out-of-jail insurance cost? The Joint Committee noted that “according to a recent analysis by the Congressional Budget Office, the lowest-cost family non-group plan under HR 3862 [the Pelosi bill] would cost $15,000 by 2016.”

Obama’s bill only provides subsidies to help pay this enormous sum after families making about $45,000 have paid 8 percent of their income for insurance and after those earning a household income of about $65,000 have kicked in 12 percent.

Five years in prison by the feds. Five years for not complying with this. People who don't pay for the stay out of jail insurance are so much of a threat to society that they need to be locked up for five years in club fed next to murderers, rapists, and child molesters. What the hell is going on here? I can shoot someone in the leg and get far less jailtime than that. Felonious assault is 4 years. I know of rapists who get less than 5 years.

The only winners from this piece of trash house bill is the insurance industry whose coffers swell, government for their ability to increase control, and the prison building industry, to deal with all the new threats to society. We already have over 7 million people in the corrections systems of this country, why not add more? I'm sure the democrats AG candidate Gretchen Whitmer who is a Blue Cross heir, loves this legislation.

This bill needs to die, fast.

11 comments:

Communications guru said...

Are you really going to base a post on that false Republican teabagger party talking point?

The penalty under the House health care reform bill for failure to purchase insurance is a tax, not jail time.

“The legislation is very fair in this respect.” I’m glad I took a look at the Youtube. Wow, that’s’ a classic case of taking something out of context.

Section 501 of the House health care reform bill provides that an individual must be "covered by acceptable coverage at all times." "Acceptable coverage" includes "qualified health benefits plan coverage," "grandfathered health insurance coverage," "Medicare," "Medicaid," coverage provided to members of the armed forces and their dependents, "coverage under the veteran's health care program," people who receive health care "through the Indian Health Service," or other coverage deemed acceptable by the Secretary of Health and Human Services. If a person does not have acceptable health care coverage, Section 501 imposes a tax on that person "not to exceed the applicable national average premium":

http://docs.house.gov/rules/health/111_ahcaa.pdf#page=304
(a) TAX IMPOSED.-In the case of any individual who does not meet the requirements of subsection (d) at any time during the taxable year, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 2.5 percent of the excess of-

(1) the taxpayer's modified adjusted gross income for the taxable year, over

(2) the amount of gross income specified in section 6012(a)(1) with respect to the taxpayer.

(b) LIMITATIONS.-

(1) TAX LIMITED TO AVERAGE PREMIUM.-

(A) IN GENERAL.-The tax imposed under subsection (a) with respect to any taxpayer for any taxable year shall not exceed the applicable national average premium for such taxable year.

Now, willful failure to pay income taxes can result in civil or criminal penalties – including jail time, and that’s what you and the rightwing media is basing their lie on.

I wonder, is there any lie you won’t tell to stop 50 million Americans from getting affordable health care.

Republican Michigander said...

Teabagger? You seem to use that word an awful lot, Kevin. Are you trying to tell us something? Does your wife know about that?

This penalty, as it is called by the politicians, is a fine disguised as a tax. Pelosi and company have brought debtor's prison back to the US.

Communications guru said...

I do because it describes the lunatic fringe your party has become. I know to some people it also means a sexual act, but not to me. It’s also not just an act exclusive to homosexuals. But, if you want to say I’m a homosexual, go right ahead; it doesn’t bother me.

The fact is you lied, and you can’t dispute what I wrote or defend your position.

Chris said...

Maybe he should change his name to the Teabag Guru since it is not only always on his mind but most likely on his chin. Guru you only give half of the story. Try googling it if you don't believe me Teabag Guru. RM you have a great blog here. I also have a political blog you might like.

Communications guru said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Republican Michigander said...

Kevin, I don't give a damn what team you bat for. It's none of my business. No I don't believe you're a homosexual, but I do wonder what goes through your head since you use the term teabagger all the time. It's frankly a subject I really don't think about all that much, not that there's anything wrong with that.

I deleted the post. No graphic stuff allowed here. I don't need a graphic description of "teabagging" on this site. Most people know what it is, but I don't need it here.

I will leave this part up so people can see what I am responding too.

Kevin said:

""Even Factcheck blew away your lie. I’m sure I’m going to get the Obama/Ayers lie, but you lies.

The sections you quote for the jail penalty are not even in the bill. “These are not sections of the House bill itself. Rather, they are sections of the current Internal Revenue Code.”

When can I expect a retraction? """

Reponse to Kevin's Post:

As far as Annenberg (Obama and his buddy Bill Ayers has ties to Annenberg through Annenberg challenge) "factcheck" goes, that's bullshit.

Fact - The "fine" for not having approved insurance is given as a tax on gross income. It's meant as a penalty, more than a revenue measure.

Fact - If you don't pay it, it's a five year felony. The charge is tax evasion which is part of the internal revenue code.

Under current law, there's no jail for not having insurance. Under the new bill, there's a fine and a stiff prison sentence for not paying.

Communications guru said...

If you “don’t give a damn what team I bat for” why did you bring it up? Funny, what’s obscene is your constant lies and anti-American cheerleading. “Too graphic?” Oh, please. I can see why you want my post deleted. It called you out on your lies. What a coward you are.

Here’s the link he deleted: http://factcheck.org/2009/11/imprisoned-for-not-having-health-care/

Very selective editing. When you say, “I will leave this part up so people can see what I am responding too (sic)” you are lying.

President Obama has no ties to Bill Ayers. That teabagger lie has been debunked numerous times. Factcheck is nonpartisan and nonprofit. I guess the facts have a liberal bias, as well as anything that does not agree with your narrow anti-government and anti-American view of the world.

You said, “…people who disregard the federal mandate to buy health insurance to prison.” That is an outrageous lie. Show me in the bill where it says that.

You also said, “he (sic) nonpartisan Joint Committee on Taxation reported that the House version of the healthcare bill specifies that those who don’t buy health insurance and do not pay the fine of about 2.5 percent of their income for failing to do so can face a penalty of up to five years in prison!” Another lie. Show me where in the bill it says that.

Better yet, show me where Section 7203 and Section 7201 are in the bill. Another lie.

Once again, when can I expect a retraction?

Republican Michigander said...

You brought it up with your obsession with the word "teabagger".

If I was a coward, I would simply banned you from commenting. While this is not a free speech blog, it is lenient. I let you post you lies here.

As far as Section 7201 and Section 7203 goes, it's not in the bill, but the bill references the current law, as I already pointed out. In fact, I still have the book with that code at home.

What Pelosi's statist bill does is classify the fine for not having government approval as income tax, and subjects people to that law. It is debtor's prison. Take government approved insurance, pay the fine, I mean tax, and go to prison.

7201 - Attempt to Evade or Defeat tax. Felony. $100,000 fine. 5 years in prison.

7203 - Willful failure to file return, supply information, or pay tax. Misdemeanor. $25,000 fine. 1 year in prison.

To be specific, Chapter 75 - Crimes, other offenses and forfeitures. Subchapter A. Crimes. Part 1. General provisions.

The Book - Selected Income Tax Provisions, Federal Transfer Taxes, Code and Regulations. 2008 edition.

Your accountant and/or tax lawyer I'm sure has a copy of the book.

Communications guru said...

No, you brought it up. Obviously, your mind is in the gutter. Every rightwing protest is a “tea party.” My definition of a teabagger - which you deleted - is “A whining fool shouting loudly for liberty but not willing to pay the bill.”

Ah, but you have tried to ban me. I have never lied; not here or on my blog. I stand by my statement.

So, does that mean you will delete: “The bill describes the penalties as follows?” It doesn’t say that.

Again, you said, “…people who disregard the federal mandate to buy health insurance to prison.” That is an outrageous lie. Show me in the bill where it says that. No one is going to jail for not buying health insurance and you know it. That makes you a liar.

Again, Once again, when can I expect a retraction, or at the very least a correction?

Republican Michigander said...

“The bill describes the penalties as follows?”

It does. It subjects people to a fine and jailtime if there is no compliance by subjecting them to the tax code.

Don't comply with the federal power grab, and you go to prison.

Communications guru said...

No where in the bill does it say,” Five years in prison for not buying government approved insurance” like your lie of a headline. No where. First, no one is going to prison, and second, you do not have to buy government approved insurance.

A “federal power grab?” Give me a break. Again, no one -no one - is going to prison for not buying health insurance. That is just one more lie tea baggers like you are using to try and scare people.

Once again, when can I expect a retraction, or at the very least a correction?